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Creation Or Re-Creation?

Posted by Mr. Nice Guy on July 24, 2009

I’ve been pondering, debating, and presenting this point of view for a while now. I’m a Christian, but I don’t hold to the view that the earth is less than 7,000 years old.  I believe that mankind may only be 7,000 years old, but this planet has been here for a very long time.  I also hold the view that humans were not the first intelligent race that God created on this planet.  Maybe angels lived on the planet before we did, but that’s all speculation.

What We Know From A Biblical Perspective

According to the Bible water was not created on any of the first seven days. Its already there in Genesis 1:2. We also know that Lucifer is already a fallen angel when we reach Genesis 3. My assumption based on those 2 fact are that whatever happened, happened sometime before verse 2 of Genesis. Most people call it the Gap Theory.

What Does The Ancient Hebrew Say?

Genesis 1:2 – Tohu Va Bohu – Means waste and desolate, ruined and uninhabitable. We translate it, “without form and void”.

There is another translation problem: “Was” should actually be translated “became”. So it should read, “The earth became ruined and uninhabitable.”

I’m not the type of guy that just goes about making claims about the Bible without any scripture to back up my claim.

What Else Does The Bible Say About It?

One thing we have to remember, is that the Bible didn’t have periods, commas, chapters, and verses. It was written almost like one continuous though.

I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light. I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly. I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled. I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger. For thus hath the LORD said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end. For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black; because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it.” – Jeremiah 4:23-28

One can make the argument that God is specifically talking to Israel or mankind in general here. There are problems with that theory though. This has never happened in the Bible except in Genesis 1:2. Even at the “end of the age” the world is never completely destroyed. This should also raise the question of “why was darkness upon the face of the deep and the Spirit of God hovering over the water in Genesis?”

What Did God Mean By This?

There is another passage that seems almost out of context when you read it.

“For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else.” – Isaiah 45:18

Why would God say that he didn’t create it in vain? Another word for vain is useless, without a purpose. In Genesis, in the Hebrew, we find that the world is uninhabitable, rendering it useless, but in Isaiah, God says He didn’t create it that way.

Does Solomon Know Something About This?

“Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.” – Proverbs 8:31

Wisdom is speaking in this chapter, and you will notice that Wisdom claims to be the first of God’s creation, before the earth or anything else.  What did Wisdom/Solomon mean when he said the “habitable part of His earth?” That clearly implies that some portion was uninhabitable for some reason.  The only problem we have here is that Wisdom rejoiced with the sons of men. Its a problem unless you know that for some reason, angels always appear as men, they are referred to as the sons of God in Genesis 6, Job 1,2, and 38:7.

The Greeks and a few other cultures have a few interesting stories involving multiple creations of mankind. Maybe early mankind recorded their history somehow or it was relayed to these ancient cultures by some means. As far fetched as the theory sounds, there is historical evidence, as far as writing goes, to support the theory.

What Did Adam and Noah Have In Common?

“And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.” Genesis 1:28

“And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.” Genesis 9:1

That’s pretty interesting that God would tell them the same exact thing. If my theory on Genesis 1:2 is correct, God told Adam this after a great judgment was passed on the earth.  Noah was also told this after the judgment of the Flood had just destroyed the earth.

The evidence seems to point to something far greater than most of us want to or care to imagine. I think science and religion can be unified if both sides were to open their hearts and minds to what could have been and what may be to come.

What do you think?


11 Responses to “Creation Or Re-Creation?”

  1. thebloomingmind said

    The bible says a lot of extremely vague things that can and will be twisted around to support anybody’s theory. I beleive the Bible is the most inaccurate source of information there is (just my opinion). And to think that we humans have been here since the Earth came to be… really? That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Dinosaurs ruled the Earth for some odd 150 million years, in which time humans were none existant. We evolved just like everything else did. We are not so special. If dinosaurs never died out, we would not, by any means, be here today… or at least we would not be top of the food chain anyways.

    • Actually, its only vague if you don’t read the Bible as one whole body of work, and the notion that it can be twisted is also false to anyone that has read the entire thing. If you haven’t read it or comprehended it, anything can and will be twisted by anyone, including the U.S. Constitution. Its actually a very accurate source of information, but I’d appreciate an example of where the Bible was wrong on one single historical matter. Not discovering it yet doesn’t mean its wrong, it means we haven’t discovered it yet, but there are plenty discoveries to support the Bible. I also say this about these fossils that are “millions” of years old. Lets see the fossils. Not drawings or plaster that they have in museums, but the real deal. Lets see the evolutionary fossil record that exists. I’ve been asking non-believers for years to point me to a source that shows real fossils, and not drawings, and have yet to get so much as a single link to any site.

      Evolution is a simply laughable idea, and anyone using common sense, observation, can see that the evidence simply isn’t there, as much as they would love for it to be. I’ve asked before, and I’ll ask again, simply post a link to an actual fossil record to support your claims for evolution. If not, point to a video or study in which evolution was directly observed.

  2. Greetings from Israel. First of all, it’s “Toho Vavohu” (meaning “utter chaos”, which isn’t that far off the mark)

    The Jewish Torah doesn’t actually spell out how many years have passed since the earth was formed, but if “years” are the same today as they were then (or even if they were lunar years, as was the case for most of Jewish history, and Jews still use lunar months for the Jewish calender)

    • I wasn’t aware of the exact spelling so I checked on Google and Tohu Va Bohu came up the most. LOL. I also saw Tohu Vavohu as you mention, but not as frequent, so I went with the other spelling. Thanks though.

      That’s too bad that it doesn’t give an estimate of how old the earth is. From what I gather, Genesis 1:1 is just God putting the earth back together again, and not creating it from scratch.

      • It’s Toho Vavohu, there’s an Hebrew grammatical rule that forces Bet to become unaccented if it comes after “Vav hahibur”. But again, Hebrew, never mind that.

        Listen, the bible hints towards a very young earth. You really shouldn’t use it as a history book. I don’t think it was ever intended as a history book, anyway.

      • I disagree with the Bible hinting at a young earth. I think people assume the young earth theory. Let me ask you this. On what day was water created? Why is it “without form and void” but later God says He didn’t create it that way? What happened that caused it to become without form and void? Why was Adam told to Replenish the earth if nothing was on it before?

      • Umm… No. I studied the Torah Neviim Ktuvim at school. For TWELVE years. According to the Jewish tradition, which has been going on for millenia, the earth is about 5,700 years old (which is different than the Christian tradition, mark you).

        This is a culmination of millenia of research. you may choose to believe otherwise, frankly, that only proves to me this book will read to you whatever it is you want it to.

        By the way, your theory is even more absurd. What does “without form and void mean”? In Jewish tradition it means “there was nothing” and then “God made something out of that nothing”. According to Jewish tradition, this nothing occurred about 2000 years BEFORE the domestication of the cow. Allegory, my friend. Nothing wrong with it.

      • So when was the water created? Its obvious it couldn’t have been “nothing” there, as you say, because God’s Spirit was hovering over the water. Which is it, nothing or there was something (water). I’m just curious what your view is on that.

      • Firstly, I suggest you give me an exact verse, since I studied the bible in Hebrew and not in English, you may as well read some Greek or Latin translation into English. Remember, Genesis was written in Hebrew, it underwent 3 other languages before you read it, too.

        Second, even if the water was there before the planet, there is absolutely no evidence that the planet did not exist 6000 years ago, whether because it was on hiatus, or because it simply never existed prior to that. Even if the “water” did exist and the planet “did not”, there is no evidence whatsoever that this was the case. On the contrary (and that’s the understatement of the year).

        May I ask you again why are you insisting on it? This should by no means be any obstruction to your faith in God or even in the bible. Just don’t look at this ancient mythological compendium as a history book. You wouldn’t use geometry books written by Euclid in today’s classrooms, right? Move on with the times, my friend. That’s what I’m telling ya.

      • I see now what the problem is. You didn’t read the post. My entire post was centered around Genesis 1:1-2. This doesn’t affect my belief in God at all, it actually cements it, because if my theory is correct, science is right about the age of the earth, but wrong about the age of mankind.

        No disrespect, but the Jews missed the fact the Jesus is the Messiah that they had been waiting for. So to me, its not totally impossible that you are missing what I’m saying. The Bible is still more than relevant. Research string theory and believe it or not, you’ll find that the entire idea traces back to Genesis.

  3. wellwateredgarden said

    The Concordant Version of the Old Testament has it this way: “In a beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth. As for the earth, it became to be a chaos and vacant, and darkness was over the surface of the abyss. And the spirit of Elohim was vibrating over the surface of the waters. -Genesis 1:1-3

    I agree with you that if everyone was honest and not just simply bent on ‘proving’ pet theories, including Christians, we might gain some meaningful dialogue with one another.

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